Alhaji Dahiru Ibrahim is a product of Government College, Zaria, better known as Barewa, Class of 1962. He trained as a telecommunication engineer in the United Kingdom and spent a lot of his career in the Broadcasting Company of Northern Nigeria (BCNN), which ran the Radio and Television, Kaduna. He rose to become the chief engineer of the organisation before moving to the Nigerian Television Authority (NTA), Kano, where he became the General Manager in 1986. He also served as commissioner in various ministries in Kano, from where he retired and now engages in many extracurricular activities, including the leadership of the Barewa Old Boys Association.

I would like to take you back to your early days in Wudil.

I was born in Wudil, July 14, 1940. In the whole of the district, there was only one elementary school. I went to that school when I was seven. I stayed there for four years.

In 1951, there was a qualifying examination to come to Kano, the present Rumfa College, which was then Kano Middle School. Then in 1953, the authorities decided to separate the primary section from the junior secondary section, they decided that there would only be one class from Middle Three, Four, Five, up to the end of the secondary school. So, unfortunately, I was one of the ones who were dropped out from the middle school. There were too many students, so I was one of those who were dropped at the end of 1953.

 

Meaning that you were asked to go home?

You were asked to go and find somewhere else. Around that time, there was this school coming up. They called it Technical College at Kofan Nasarawa when it was started in 1953. I went to the school to ask for admission but they said I was too small. It was really a technical and practical school.

 

Too small in terms of size or age?

Size. Age was an advantage because when I left Wudil in 1951,  I was six and a half. I was really small when I went to the Middle School. I was known as Dahiru ‘Tiny’.

That one year, there was no school for me. I was so keen in furthering my studies, so I was going to what was known as British Council. It is not there anymore.I spent most of my time there.

 

Reading?

Reading a lot and watching cinema. Also in Wudil at that time, there was a library with lots of books. In fact, I wish I could find some of those books now.

They had just opened a senior primary school in Birnin Kudu, so my uncle, who was working in the Native Authority (NA), as it was called, gave me a note to the Councilor of Education, Kano.

I think it was Alhaji Usman Gwarzo, pleading with him to let me enter that new senior primary school in Birnin Kudu. He said, ‘okay go home.’

After a few days, I was called and sent to the newly established Kano City Senior Primary School, which I would have joined if they hadn’t removed me.

The primary part of the school was later moved to Kano City, where Shekara Girls’ School is now. So in 1955, I was there, and when we did the second exam, I got through. So, in January 1956, I went to Barewa College.

 

It seems Barewa was a fairly exclusive school in northern Nigeria; was it difficult to be selected into the college?

They tried to set the standards fairly higher than other places. And that year – early 1956 or late 1955 – I think only three of us were taken from Kano Province. In fact, one of them was from Sabon Gari because they were considering missionary schools for admission. One of my colleagues was Joseph Lawson, a Yoruba man. Garba Habib was from Dambatta.

 

How was the experience in Barewa?

I was there for seven years.

 

Up to HSC?

Yes. The first thing I experienced was the visit of the Queen. She came to northern Nigeria in 1956. And we had just barely entered the college.

When the Queen came, a number of us were selected to go and wave the flag for her.

And being very small, I was lucky to have some senior students who were concerned about me. I was lucky to be included in those who went there.

I can remember that one of my seniors (just one year my senior), Umaru Muhammad Baba, was a onetime minister of petroleum. He was taking care of me. It was such a struggle getting any food. Umaru Muhammad Baba was one who got for me.

 So, right from the beginning, there was this camaraderie. It was a wonderful experience because I was alone there. In fact, Garba Habib was not in the list, so I didn’t know anybody and I had just been in school a couple of weeks.

Was it in Barewa that your talent in electronics started to show?

Yes. There was a new student named Muhammad Bello Tunau. I don’t know whether you know him.

 

From Sokoto?

From Sokoto.

 

Did he also end up in the NTA?

He did. In 1960 we formed an association known as Radio Club. We were interested in electronics and wireless communication. At one time, Bello was in trouble because he actually built a very small transmitter and the PNT people came looking for him. That was the beginning.

He was four years behind me. I was there in 1956 and he came in 1960. But all the same, since we had a common interest, we continued in this line.

When I eventually entered higher school for the Higher School Certificate(HSC) my subjects were Physics, Chemistry and Mathematics. Then white teachers who were also in that line were helping us to get the parts and pieces for construction of items.

 

So you built a radio?

Yes.

 

What was it for?

It was for listening to local stations.

 

Just in your room or for the whole school?

In my room. I mean where we used to meet. We used to call it broad-band layout, actually. It was a cardboard. And that time, the transistor had come in, so you could do it with a torchlight battery. And you could power it and use headphones to listen because it would not take a speaker. That was what we did.

I remember one time when I came to Kano for holidays and a lot of my old friends were coming to where I was living to see the radio.

 

By the time you were in higher school at Barewa, did you make up your mind on what to do next?

Yes. I said I was going to remain in the electronics field. And I did not miss any opportunity to attend any event related to electronics, television or radio. In fact, the very first television we saw was at the Ahmadu Bello University; I think when it was Nigerian College of Arts and Technology. One of the departments came and demonstrated what a television looked like and I made sure I was there. I pursued that.

At one time when they introduced radio transmitters in the provinces, they brought one to Kano. It was during our holidays and I made sure I attended. That was the very first radio transmitter we had in Kano – Kano Radio.

Before that, it was only this radio fusion service where you had the radio piped to boxes in your houses. It was piped, and it was part of Post and Telegraphs (P&T). That was the first radio.

At that time, there were radio sets with huge battery on top. They called it Radio Maigoyo. One of my uncles, in fact, the one who facilitated my return to school had one and I was always fiddling with it when he was not looking.

 

You started work as a technical assistant; did you intend to go to the Ahmadu Bello University? Was it a choice?

It was a choice. If I wanted to go to the ABU, it had to be Electrical Engineering. And at that time, I think they were not even paying much attention to light electrical engineering, which radio and electronics come into.

In fact, the moment we finished, in 1962 the BCNN was born – the Radio and Television Service; and since they announced it, that’s what I wanted to do.

By the time we finished our HSC in December, I did not even come back to Kano; I went to Kaduna and a friend introduced me to the late Tatari Ali. He was the permanent secretary in the Ministry of Establishment in the Northern Region.

He wrote a letter for me to go to the managing director of the BCNN. He interviewed me and asked. “When do you want to start?” I told him that I wanted to start the following day, but the chief engineer, who was a white man, advised me to go and rest for one month so that I would come back early February, because it was already the end of December.

That was how I joined the Broadcasting Company of Northern Nigeria, with Radio and Television. I came home and was counting the days.

 

Was there a prospect for training or you just took a chance to do the work and the training happened by luck?

I took a chance, but also noted that most of the engineers were foreigners; they were white people. Well, after I joined, they were running classes for us who had not had any formal training in electronics and communication.

So I had an advantage because I had been through school certificate and HSC, and majority of my classmates and colleagues were just school certificate holders. That was in 1963.

As we worked there, we got training and were also running around, first in studios, then transmitters to learn the ropes. At a time, an opportunity came; I think either the organisation requested for places or they were offered places for students to go and study. Incidentally, the BCNN was a joint venture.

 

With the BBC?

Not the BBC. It was the Electronic and Musical Industries (EMI), and Granada Television. Granada Television was to give the knowledge of production and news casting and so on, while the EMI provided the technical equipment and training.

When they gave us the scholarship, the two of us were taken in 1964. We went to South London College. It was earlier a technical college. Originally, it was a Naval Communication Training Centre.

 

How was the experience?

It was very interesting. There was a lot of discrimination, such that when you were looking for a house, it was written in black and white that they did not want blacks. But fortunately, in South London, there was a lot of black population – from Brixton down to Croydon and so on – we weathered it. In fact, in the school, the whites were fewer in number.

 

Were there Nigerians you related with?

There were some Nigerians. In fact, when we went the first year, there was one George Bako. He was there for the first year. Of course we related with him since he was going back to the BCNN and we were from the same corporation. There was no problem.

 At that time, things were not very difficult; and during long holidays we used to get small jobs. Some would go and distribute letters for the posts, while others would find a job in maintenance. I worked almost every year during summer in one company in Croydon for six weeks or so to get extra money.

 

Did you need the money or because the scholarship wasn’t carrying you?

The money would help us to do other things we could not do with our allowances. The allowance was 39 pounds for northern students. With extra money you could afford to buy things, as well as send something to your brothers at home.

 

You also went to Japan for training; how was that experience?

It was very interesting.

 

More strange than the United Kingdom?

It was different, not strange. There was also some kind of racism there. I went to Japan because the BCNN was buying transmitters from the Nippon Electric Company (NEC) and there was a training package.

Again, the two of us went and they put us in a hotel. We were there for several months and used that opportunity to go for sightseeing. We went to several cities, Tokyo, where we were. There were Kyoto, Osaka, Nara and a lot of other places. It was an opportunity to see their culture. It was very interesting. That was in 1974.

 

You stayed very long in the BCNN, rising to the position of a chief engineer; Didn’t you want to move to other opportunities?

I wanted to stay in broadcasting – electronics and communication. And the BCNN was a radio and television service station.

The radio service was paid for by all the northern states – six of them then, as well as the television, which was received in Kano and North-Central states – Kaduna and Katsina.

As time went on, there was this urge by state governments to set up their own television services. As a result, stations like Benue-Plateau Television, North-West Television, and of course, Kano Television, were created. There was no NTA then.

The then governor of Kano, the late Audu Bako, said we should better find people who could set up the station and get it going. Although I was the chief engineer there, I agreed because they wanted us to come home. I said it was an opportunity.

 

Did you move as a chief engineer?

It was called head of engineering. I left the position of a chief engineer where I had both radio and television, to Kano Television, where it was just television. It was one of my targets to come home, at least for some years and maybe get settled and find a house. Although I was already married in Kaduna, it was an opportunity.

 

How come you were later made the general manager of the station? I am not sure that many engineers became general managers of television stations.

It is rare. But if you can recall, Vincent Maduka, an engineer, was even the director-general of the NTA.

In fact, when I was the chief engineer in the BCNN, there was a time he came to visit from Ibadan. I was the one who conducted him around to see what our station was like, and so on.

 

Tell us about your experience as general manager, especially coming from engineering. How did you cope with other aspects of broadcasting?

When I was in the BCNN as a chief engineer, there were other heads of departments, such as the late Sani Katsina, who was in charge of programmes. Rufai Dawaki, also now late, took over from him. So, one can say that one was quite aware of what other departments were doing, and so on.

 When I came to Kano, although they asked us to come, they formally advertised what they were looking for, so that other people could apply.  I was already the chief engineer of a radio-television station. However, I applied. But of course, like you said earlier, journalists and programme people were more inclined or favoured to head  stations.

I was next to the general manger, Muhammad Ibrahim because we came together. I was the next in command, so when the NTA zones were formed, Ibrahim was made a zonal managing director of the North-West Television and I acted in his position for more than a year before they decided to appoint us.

 

As general manager?

Yes. That was in 1979.

 

As an engineer, how did you cope with the broadcasting and politics side of the job?

Fortunately, I had people who were really( good ). Dr Madu Mailafia was in charge of news. But there was a little complication there because of religion, being Kano.

And for programmes, we also had someone from Kano who had spent a lot of time in radio, not television, but all the same, Muhammad Ibrahim,  recommended him and made him the manager.

There were administration and finance. It was not particularly difficult because when I was chief engineer in Kaduna, it was the largest, although it was a service department. I think we accounted for almost 30 per cent of the staffing.

We constructed our own studio furniture, had vehicles, and of course, maintained our generators. So it was not particularly difficult to take care of the station.

Of course, for journalistic things and so on, we consulted. I had very cooperative managers, so I had no problem. The only problem was maybe when politics came in.

 

You served as a commissioner from 1986 to 1991, even under the military; tell us about the transition from professional work as an engineer and manager to politics.

It was easier because it was the military in charge. The trouble did not start until 1979. It was after that period that we really started getting problems from presidential liaison officers. I think the first one we had here was Lawal Kaita, before he went to become governor. You know there was a difference between the National Party of Nigeria (NPN) and the Peoples Redemption Party (PRP).

 

How did you get appointed in the first place?

I really don’t know. One day, I was sitting in the office and our news staff, who were always covering the Government House, all came back running and saying that I had been appointed commissioner. 

 

Nobody consulted you?

No. However, Ahmed Daku, the governor was a personal friend. Although he was two years behind me in Barewa, we were very close and he kept calling me every day, saying he was going to include me in his government. But I said I was not really interested.

 

Why were you not interested?

I didn’t want to leave broadcasting. I preferred what I knew best. But all the same, he said he had to do that and I told him to go ahead.

But there was pressure in Kano because they said ( Military Governor) Daku was not doing what they wanted, and so on. 

 

From your vantage point, what was Daku’s problem?

Well, they said he was not releasing money for things. He was very cautious about spending public money, but they were in a hurry; they wanted him to bring out money to do work, and so on.

There were some very influential people in Kano and they kept going to General Babangida and complaining about him. So, suddenly, he was transferred to Sokoto.

 

Where things were slower?

Well, maybe they were more tolerant. I called him and said, “You see, I told you I was not going to work in government.” I didn’t know that he had already listed those he wanted to be commissioners. So, when ( Colonel)Ndagi Umaru came, apparently, he took a look at the list and picked few from Daku’s list and added to his own. My name was on the list. Maybe he consulted with him, I don’t know. I never asked him.

 

You were made commissioner for Agriculture?

No; Works and  and Housing because it was more technical. 

 

 

As a local man from Wudil with this high profile job, how did you cope?

The concentration of the government was to complete all the abandoned projects. There were a lot of abandoned projects, right from Commissioner of Police Audu Bako’s time.

Those things – the stadium, school of nursing, a lot of others – were already on ground and we had to find the best way to complete them. I really had no problem.

 

But Kano people also complained of Ndagi Umaru,  because they found him rather different from Daku. As a member of his cabinet, how did you take that?

Well, I had no problem with him. In fact, I think what they said about him had to do with land. By the time they sent him away, the new governor, General Idris Garba, didn’t want any trouble on the land issue, so he appointed me as commissioner for land. And you know that land in Kano was not easy; all the big people were on you all the time doing one thing or another. But we coped.

In fact, at one time, General Idris Garba called me and said, “These people are still disturbing me. I have appointed you as commissioner for land, so why don’t you deal with them?”

 

So they go to him thinking he would order you to allocate lands to them?

I said we were trying our best and we would take every case on its merit. I don’t know whether that was the reason he eventually moved me away from there to Commerce, Industry and Cooperatives . These are also technically-oriented.

 

Everybody would have expected land, and perhaps, money; how did you cope with local pressure from your people?

Unfortunately for me, I closed my eyes. There were many friends who fell out with me because I would not give them land. Over the years, there were thousands of outstanding applications for land. What we did was to take the oldest ones first and pick a few new ones. That was how the allocations were made.

Members of staff of the ministry were also crying, so for a layout somewhere, we decided to pick a large number of the staff so that they would be a little bit happier.

And when people ask how many acres of land I have because I was a commissioner, I tell them that I don’t have a single land. They expected that I should have land, but I never allocated any land to myself or my children.

Was the land where your house is built allocated to you?

When I was in the NTA, and even before Daku came, I already had an application in the ministry. The promise was that if we had a certificate, the NTA would give us loans to build. So, immediately he came, it was a favourable situation and I presented my documents and he allocated this one to me. That was before 1990 because he left here before I became a commissioner. I think he left in 1986. The certificate is dated 1986.

 

Are you still in touch with Daku?

Oh yes; very much so. He is someone who doesn’t like to be involved too much with a lot of noise in the government. There were times he came to Kano to attend Islamic Forum meetings. And a couple of times he stayed here with me. As a former governor they can open any place for him, but he didn’t want to go there. He is a low-profile person and we relate very well.

 

Did your public service end from 1991 when Jigawa State was created from Kano?

Yes. The choice I had was to go back to the NTA, but of course, my position had already been filled. So the choice was for me to go to the headquarters in Lagos.

I already had a family here and I didn’t feel comfortable to leave them. And I could not stand the trouble of maybe coming every two weeks or so. So I decided to retire from the NTA in July 1991.

After that, I formed the Northern Communications and Television, but the company is no longer (in existence). It was a small electronics company. I had an office at Gidan Goldie for several years. It will interest you to know that the very first job I had was in Katsina – the relocation of Katsina Television from some place, which was on the path of the airport. They said they wanted to move it. So I had the job of relocating that station.

Of course other opportunities came. We also worked in Cross River State because at that time, U.F Ahmed was the governor. We did some other things.

 

So you had a thriving private sector consultancy?

It was fairly good. I did work for Gombe; and towards the end, also in Nasarawa State.

 

What happened to the company?

I could not maintain it, so I was getting others in our field to work together. In fact, what brought the end was when I had the office in Gidan Goldie and they suddenly decided that they were going to restructure it, so we all had to go out. I came home with my computer.

 

Who decided the restructuring?

The owners of the building. They gave us notice to quit. I went home with my computer, printer and all that and waited for them to finish, but by the time they finished, they quadrupled the rent and I wondered why I should go there. I was happy where I was. That’s how I left. But as things went on, age was catching up and I virtually wound up the company.

 

 What do you do for a living now?

Well, for a living, I have my passion, which is nothing to talk about. I am a member of the Board of Directors of Freedom Radio. We have a microfinance bank.

 

Is the microfinance bank working?

Yes.

 

Are you the chairman?

Yes

 

Is it the Wudil Microfinance Bank?

Yes; but we have changed the name because we are going to expand to reach other places. It will be known as Ultrapay Microfinance Bank.

 

So you are upgrading the bank?

We are upgrading it so that we can do online transactions. It was set up as a community bank in 1992, just one year after my retirement; and that will not get us anywhere.

The capital was then N500,000; and eventually, the National Board of Community Banks increased the share capital, I think to N5 million. I think there were 32 community banks in Kano, but eventually, there are only four of us now.

 

Having stopped much of formal work, how do you occupy your time now?

Well, there’s not very much for me at this age. I rely on income from pension and these side jobs like being a director in this station, as well as the microfinance bank.

I am also the chairman of the Local Government Development Association; and that gives us a chance to come across something.

Also, my children are all grown up and some of them are assisting me in running my life. I don’t have small children anymore; they have all graduated. One of them is in my line; he is the Director of Engineering of the Freedom Radio Group. They are three boys and four girls. All the women are also graduates and married. They have small businesses they do. That’s the story of my life.

 

You have been the president of the Barewa Old Boys College Association since 2017; is it something you really enjoy doing or it was thrust on you?

When Dr Umaru Mutallab was president, I was second vice president and Bashir Tukur was the first vice president. At the end of his tenure, we allowed two tenures of four years each. At the end of his tenure, Tukur refused to attend meetings because he didn’t want to get involved in all the trouble. So the consensus was that I should become the president. That was 2017.

It was four years in the first instance, then another four years. So I am just winding up (March). In fact, we will have our Annual General Meeting this February and that will be the end of my tenure of eight years.

I did enjoy it but it was not easy. There are people who could help and those who could not. Others cannot be reached, etc. But all the same, there are some very supportive members who help us to run the association, as well as do some development in the college.

 

You have former heads of state and many leaders in virtually all aspects of Nigerian life, yet you sound as if it’s something you had difficulty doing; why?

We are proud of all the big leaders. In fact, from my first work experience, if you talk of the BCNN, almost everybody on top there was a Barewa.

They were helping a lot, but it is either they are no more or they are not strong enough to do things for us. They can’t get involved too much with the running of the association; that’s why we have difficulty.

And the college is now virtually the property of the Kaduna State Government. So, there may be some members who are no longer keen to do things for the college because the original concept is no more.

But as I said, there are still members who are willing to help us and we are very grateful to them. I am sure that whoever becomes president will pursue other people we have not been able to touch.

 

Is it difficult for you to run around for meetings – going to Zaria, Kaduna to keep things going?

Yes. It is not easy since I am not doing anything in particular. In fact, the first time they elected me, I told them that they were electing an NTA retiree who would not be able to do things other presidents would do. But they insisted.

I told them that once in a while they may have to look for money to facilitate my travels; and they have been doing that. 

 

How do you spend your day? Do you still mix with friends?

Yes. As I said, I have my close family – the children and brothers and sisters. There are always things happening in the family, so we are very busy.

Just recently, we had a family gathering. And you have to plan for events because there are grandchildren and great-grandchildren who are getting married, going to school, looking for work and so on. A lot of our time really goes there.

But as far as the family is concerned, I hardly travel now, except for these meetings. And I am quite happy because at least I know I have my daily walk to the mosque and back; and that helps a lot. Of course I watch your programmes.

 

Do you have hobbies, especially in the areas of electronics, and all that?

You can’t stop that; it is really in one’s blood. Of course things are different now; there’s digitisation and all that.

We started television when it was black and white and had to go to Germany for conversion. I still don’t take any of my gadgets to anyone for repairs, I try my best. But I maybe let them do it for me if I can’t get the parts. I thank God that I can still do these things for myself; and the children to help me.